ALPHA: ESFj/ESE & INTj/LII Duality

Share your ESFj-INTj duality experiences here.

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This is my duality story.  I don't expect everyone else's to be so organized or long-winded.  I just thought doing it this way would work for me to tell all I wanted to tell.

Feel free to scroll through and read headings if you're bored with some parts of this. :P

Who are we? I am an Si-ESFj, and my dual is an Ne-INTj.  I'm not sure what stock to put in the Enneagram, but I believe I am either a 2 or a 4 (used to think I was a 6 but I think that was a mistyping) and my boyfriend is probably a 9.

Met on: January 1, 2008

Together since: January 17, 2008

About him, the LII (personality, interests, background, etc.):  Raised Catholic with liberal parents who are both musicians and teachers.  He has one sister and they had a fairly even, easy, happy childhood, according to him.  Parents are still happily married after 37 years.  Dad (possible ESFj), Mom (possible ENTj).

He is pretty shy and quiet most the time but speaks up well in groups and has many friends who always have demands on his time, which he usually takes in stride.  He does suffer from quite a bit of anxiety, however.

He has a very rich inner world where he thinks about all kinds of things he doesn't usually share.  He has an incredible ability to conceptualize but doesn't love to speculate UNLESS it has to do with something realistic and solid in life.

He vacillates between low energy and intense hours of hard work (I have seen him paint for 20 hours straight, for instance), during which time he forgets about his needs almost entirely.

As an adult, he has struggled with addiction. Currently, he is clean.

He is a very talented and creative person.  He has been playing the drums since he was small, and can play the guitar, bass guitar, and banjo as well. He's a great singer.  He has an amazing ability to harmonize and to write harmonies and to play an instrument and juggle two or three or more other instrumental parts in his mind and play along, even if those parts are not currently being played out loud!  He knows so much about his craft and is a brilliant songwriter.  He also loves performing, as I do, but does get nervous beforehand.

He is a great painter, and is going to school for his degree in art.

He has spent his adult life doing different odd jobs and playing music, and lived abroad for a time.  He has put off school until recently (we are both 28 at the moment) but has become more focused on his goal of getting a degree and a good job since two years ago.

He is also smart and quite funny, always making me laugh.

About me, the ESE (personality, interests, background, etc.):  Raised a Jehovah's Witness (I am not one now), father worked construction, mom was a homemaker and then went back to work in my teen years doing different things -- cosmetics mainly.  My childhood had a lot of difficult, emotional times, but I have good memories too.  I have four brothers.  My parents are still married after 35 years.  Dad (possible ISFp), Mom (possible INFj).

I am a basically fun-loving person who just wants to take care of my SO and make a lovely home for us.  I want to work on our home, to improve our garden and orchard, to build a chicken coop, to beautify everything in our lives.  I love cooking for my boyfriend and taking care of him.  I love going out with him and enjoying the company of our friends and serving everybody delicious food.

I'm also an artist, and have some small goals towards being more productive in that area of my life.  I see myself as at least somewhat creative and I love to make things with my hands, write music, and draw.  I also sing and play the piano and am learning the guitar and folk harp at the moment, and am in a band with my boyfriend.

I love travel and adventure but I also am very much a homebody.

I have a lot of social anxiety but always enjoy being social once I actually am in the company of other people.  I am pretty gregarious and have been called flirtatious at times with men.

I also love to learn and am currently going to school to become a teacher, possibly French or Music or both.

How we met and got together: New Year's Eve 2007-08, I was at a party with my INFj friend (we drove 400 miles to visit her ex. who threw the party).  It turned out to be quite the dud of a party.  Almost no one was there, and those who came were not great people.  My INFj buddy wanted us to ditch the party and go rent a motel room and swim in the pool.  But I had found the most adorable pink dress at a thrift store for the function earlier that week, and had got my hair done earlier that day, so I was not about to waste all that!  I was going to stick that party out.  I told my INFj friend that we never knew who we might meet.  I was not going anywhere.

So we stayed, all the while I was being hit on by this very boring guy, obviously high on coke.  He seemed to be somewhat "off" either way, and loved to hear himself talk.  No thanks.  But he didn't seem to want to leave my side.  My poor INFj friend was dealing with her ex's insecurities and seemed kind of miserable.

A little after midnight, to my relief, a few new people came in.  I was sitting on the couch at that time, where I could observe who walked in: three men.

Only one guy caught my attention.  He was quite tall, with wily curly hair.  He had a funny 30's filmstar mustache (I would later find out that this was a joke) and dark-rimmed glasses.  He was wearing a full suit, pinstriped, with a skinny 60's tie.  As he walked in, someone said hello and this curly-headed fellow started talking in a kind of friendly but nervous manner.  He was fascinating to me.

My INFj friend came over to me to tell me she was going with her ex. to try and buy more alcohol and see if any liquor stores might be open, and asked if I'd be okay alone.  She noticed the guy I was looking at, and then leaned in and whispered to me that she knew who that boy was, a musician in a great local band.  She told me she imagined we'd be able to do a lot via collaboration, musically.  She said something else memorable, but I always forget what that was and have to ask her...

Anyway, the interesting guy had left my view and walked into the kitchen where he was stuck in a conversation with the guy who had been hitting on me all night (I didn't know he was "stuck" until later).  I devised a plan to meet this intriguing man, and immediately put it into practice.

I walked past the kitchen towards the bathroom, taking care to exchange glances with him on the way.  This way, if he liked me, when I came out he might talk to me, and if he didn't like me, no rejection on either side.

I stayed in the bathroom a little nervous for a few minutes, and then came out.

I walked into the kitchen and "checked" the fridge for something to drink (a ruse).  Instantly, this tall boy abruptly ended his conversation with the annoying guy and spun around towards me, now closing the refrigerator door.  "Hi, I'm Danny," he said, and his vibe was nervous but very open at the same time.

"Malia," I smiled, and shook his hand.

"I like your dress," he went on, "do you wear dresses like that often?"

From that moment on, we talked and talked.  We made our way to the chips and guacamole, and when he found out I had made the guacamole, he proceeded to eat almost the whole bowl, which I found adorable.  Our conversation was smooth and enjoyable, and though I got a shy feel from him, he seemed quite comfortable talking to me.  The interchange was steady but not overly exciting (like I have experienced with my activity partner the ILE), but it seemed like we got along well and had a lot in common.  Besides the easiness of our interchange, we were the same age and both musicians.  The way we talked about our families also seemed similar, too.

After a time, he asked me if I wanted to go upstairs to visit with some other people he knew who lived in the apartment above.  I agreed to go.  There was something strange about that agreement; inside I felt like I was following him "home".  I can't quite explain this.  I felt he was claiming me somehow.

After some conversation upstairs, I lost sight of him talking to other people and so I made my way downstairs again, alone with my INFj girl friend.  I thought, "I don't know where that boy is, but if he likes me, he'll find me."  I should mention that I'm usually quite forward with men I like so this deferring-to-him behavior took a lot of self-control on my part(I had been listening to my ISFp male cousin who gave me a lot of relationship advice recently, and was trying to follow it and give the boy the reigns in the situation).

Well, almost immediately I heard footsteps coming down the stairs after me.  It was him!  We were locked out of the downstairs apartment and he told me, "Wait here, I'll figure out a way in."  And he did!  Pretty soon he was letting us in and asked me if I wanted any wine.  I loved his uniqueness, his individuality.  He was a new kind of boy for me.  I'd never been interested in anyone quite like him before.  In fact, in a way, part of me was not fully interested, almost like I didn't feel that spark yet.  But I was pulled to him anyway (strange feeling).

We talked until everyone had left the party, including his ride, and we talked until I was falling asleep sitting up.  He asked for my number and we hugged, and I told him I was leaving the next day for my home which was 400 miles away.

Oh!  Before we parted, he had invited me to come stay with him and record music (even though he had no idea if I was any good!).  I found this forwardness surprising since he seemed shy.  This made me think: He must really like me.

That was early Tuesday morning, technically New Year's Day.

Thursday, I was home in my parent's living room (I was there to eat dinner with them).  I told my mom about this boy I met, and told her, "If he doesn't call by today, I have to think he's not really as interested as it seemed."  Almost within the hour, I got a call on my cell phone from him!  I ran into the other room, obviously excited.

From that point on, we talked on the phone for hours almost every night (he hates the phone, so I think that tells you something).  

At one point, he left his phone somewhere for two days and I texted him during that time once.  After no reply for a day I called him and left him a message.  The next day I guess he heard it, and apparently (I found out later on) he felt really bad for not having answered my call and was terribly worried he had "blown it" or something.  He called me and when I didn't answer and he had to leave a message he felt he might have lost his chance of being with me.  I think this was really cute of him.

Anyway, two weeks from his first call, I was driving up to see him, for the supposed purpose of playing music together (this was a complete ulterior motive on both our parts, though we did do this eventually).

Our first kiss:  The day I drove up to see him, we were kind of nervous together.  He hugged me hello, and invited me in.  He played me a song on guitar.  He offered me a beer.  We went to Target to buy a food processor because I was going to make him a special dinner but I had forgotten to bring mine.  Unfortunately he had forgotten to bring his wallet and wouldn't let me pay, so we ended up just walking around target for a few minutes, nervous, not holding hands.  So nervous, nervous, nervous.

When I saw him play guitar, that was the first time I wondered when we might kiss.  I thought of just kissing him, but held back.

Then we were pretty tired.  He offered me his room ("I'll sleep upstairs" he said) to take a nap in, and asked if he could lie down next to me.  I said that would be fine!  He put in The Band's famed Last Waltz film which I hadn't seen, and we relaxed to rest and watch it.  Under the covers, he lined up his body next to mine, just so we were barely touching, and then he put one of his feet on one of my feet (shock) and then, delightfully, he took my hand and kissed it.  Wow!  Gosh, holding back and letting the guy make the first move really works, I thought.  My cousin had been right, and I liked it.

Pretty soon, Danny excused himself to go to the bathroom, but when he came back, 

he got back under the covers as before, but this time he was facing me.  As soon as I looked at him (of course I couldn't resist) the kiss came naturally.  I'm pretty sure I leaned in first, but it was mutual.  There are few memories I love more than our first kiss.

Moving in together:  After staying with my dual, and then going home, we realized how hard it was to be apart.  The phone had been fun before we were boyfriend/girlfriend, but now that we were together the phone just wasn't enough.  It was mediocre at best.  Our hearts ached for each other!  We spent long conversations whispering sweet nothings and saying things like, "I wish you were right here with me."  It was tough.  So he invited me to live with him and I moved in early March (our first Valentine's Day together, before I moved, he drove down for the weekend to be with me, which was really lovely).  Some people in my family disapproved.  They said I was being rash.  But I knew it was right.  Unlike my previous major relationship with an ILE, which had moved at a breakneck pace, even though this relationship was going fast it didn't have the crazy fervor as that activity relationship had, and I knew part of the speed with which we were getting so serious was due to the distance between us, which we absolutely hated.

Day to day life/relationship:  From the beginning, our relationship has been overall enjoyable and easy.  We have had some breaking in to do along the way, but I believe it has been easier than it could have been because I had an INTj best friend as a teen and he has an ESFj father (most likely).  Thus we have duality history in our lives and the relationship felt natural.  

More than that, we were (and still are) continually surprised at how we can just be ourselves around each other, even in the aspects of ourselves we consider negative, without being judged or feeling like any behavior we have would be a dealbreaker.  

I take on most the household chores and typically plan the meals, do the shopping and cooking, and I really enjoy the responsibility.  It's my absolute pleasure to take care of him.  He has said things like, "You take all the stress out of being a guy," which flatters me beyond compare.

Another thing I have found is that we are constantly pleasantly surprised as to aspects of one another's behavior and personality.  We continually do things where the other person will be moved to say stuff like, "I've always liked X, I can't believe you do X and I didn't know it!  That's so great!"  So what the other person does is what we are looking for in another person.

My LII really grounds me and I know that I open his emotional world up considerably.  In the beginning of our relationship, I would be jabbering away to him and he would be listening, and he would say, "I could listen to you talk for hours."  He says he just loves the sound of my voice, which completely removes my insecurity that I talk too much.

We love being together, can relax together, but also we naturally share the responsibilities of the home (example: we have a vegetable garden and I help weed and water and he does the heavy work like cultivating and tilling and sometimes the planting, too).  One thing that I love is that there is never ever a power struggle.  There is also very little effort to change one another.  Sometimes we encourage each other in a good direction, but there is no picking at each other or controlling one another.  It is a psychological relief to be understood to the extent that we usually understand each other.

Something cute is that whenever he's interested in something, I will look it up online really super fast and always keep him informed (I read something online about ESE-LII duality similar to this, and it's so true).  Also, if we start talking about something interesting to both of us, we can stay up all night talking.  Not great for work the next day or school, but absolutely great for us.  The fact that we love to hear each other talk and share ideas is incredible and feel so gratifying.

I also like that he opens up around me, moreso even than I've seen him do with his closest friends.  I love that he can make himself vulnerable to me, while being my protector in other ways (if there's a scary sound outside he always checks it out for me).

Other people notice our relationship, too.  We are always being complimented on how well we get along or how nice it is to be around us because people never have to worry we're gonna fight and make them uncomfortable.  People are always telling me that I'm going to marry him soon, and I believe it, because he's been telling me that since the beginning.

Our future goals: We both want to get married and have children (likely 2) and once we finish school and have good jobs we are going to buy a house.  We want to have land and play music together and paint.  There are so many moments when we're enjoying our time together and we just feel the spontaneous urge to say to one another, "I love you.  We're gonna have such a good life together, baby." 

Problems we've run into:  Being an ESFj (and if you read my background you'll see I had some emotional issues growing up), I'm pretty emotional.  I do very well day to day, but every so often have a low (whether for hormonal or other reasons, like a terrible migraine), and I just get all emotionally bitchy and bogged down.  I hate this about me, and I try to warn people so they don't deal with me, but I know I am hard to deal with, every so often.  So this emotional stuff my LII puts up with very well, usually, but sometimes I get so anxious I start to complain and whine and fuss about my own situation to the point where he can't take it anymore, and then he tells me sharply to "stop being mean".  I wouldn't say this is a problem we have together, more like something my poor LII deals with in our relationship.  It's not really a fight, more of him "dealing" with me (though he wouldn't say that and is very sweet about not holding it against me).

The main thing we occasionally deal with together is my feeling that I want more physical closeness and contact with him at times, and I wish he would give it, and him wanting me to understand that he isn't as much that way as me, in fact, he is MUCH more physically reserved.  It seems any time I bring this up (rarely) it causes an argument and I end up emotionally breaking down and then I get it out of my system and feel apologetic afterwards.  This stresses him out visibly.  It's a recurring thing and it only seems to happen when I'm PMS-ing or something, and I know it's super annoying.  It's annoying for me, too, though, from my perspective, to wish for physical attention and just not get it a lot of the time.  I have learned that the best thing to do is to hold back from an emotional tirade if I can and then I usually feel fine the next day.  And the less I mention this kind of stuff, the more physically open he becomes, which makes me KNOW that I need to lay off him and let him open up naturally; I have to stop trying to force things!

So in conclusion, I think that we really don't have too many problems at all, except when it comes to my emotional unhealth (imo this comes from my hormones and chemical depression in addition to my emotionally upsetting upbringing and what that did to me).  Luckily, this stuff is rare, and luckily I am aware that I can be emotionally difficult and so it is something I want to fix.  But it is not the kind of fixing as in other relationships where I feel the other person is changing me or trying to change me or doesn't like me as I am.  With this relationship, I want to become more emotionally stable because it's obvious that it's my problem (the same issues have come up only way worse in other relationships), and I love what I have with my boyfriend so much that I never want to make his life difficult, not ever.  He is not the one who has asked me to work on this, either; it's something personal that I know I want to improve.  So in a way our relationship encourages personal development but doesn't feel stifling, if that makes sense.

99% of the time our relationship is easy and enjoyable and every so often delightfully surprising, so I can't complain about the small issues we have had (in comparison to other relationships I've had, our breaking in period has been a piece of cake).

My background (only read if you are interested - long): I was born in Washington State in a rural area, with four brothers and lots of animals on a little bit of land.  My dad worked construction and my mom stayed at home with us, except for a three month brief job at an ice cream shop she took when I was three or four (she often took me with her and the smell of waffle cones is still intoxicating to me).  At age 7, after my little brother got spinal meningitis and became totally deaf, we moved to Southern California to be closer to family and good schools for the deaf.  In Orange County I had a very hard time adjusting.  I missed my old friends and my old land, and some of the pets we were forced to leave behind.  I was scornful of the city and the tract homes surrounding me and bitterly missed the home of my early childhood.  

My family was also very religious; we were Jehovah's Witnesses (I am not one now, however).  The demands of this religion also put a lot of stress on me and I was not allowed to participate in holidays or regular school functions or fun activities, and I was not allowed to have friends outside the religion.  We were different and special, "God's chosen people," and as a result of this lifestyle I was deeply withdrawn and depressed most of my teen years (though there were times I tried to break out of my depression and make friends, which I usually did easily).

As an adult, though an extrovert, I have a fair amount of social anxiety which I attribute to the religion I was raised in and its very sort of xenophobia it infused in us.

At age 10, I started piano lessons and was soon labeled a prodigy by my parents, teacher, and everyone who came to listen.  I obsessively practiced and was told by my teacher I would go to Juilliard.  Meanwhile, I was told by my church that I was not to go to college.

During my teen years, my dad was a compuslive gambler and alcoholic.  This man who always protected us and supported us kept on letting us down.  But I kept forgiving him.  Once I found out what was going on (around age 13), I really felt heartbroken.  It took me a long time to respect him the same way, ever again.  My parents also separated for a short time, but ultimately my dad quit the gambling and drinking and my parents are a lot happier as a result.

Additionally, I grew up fighting with my mom.  She is an INFj (most likely) and she and I just couldn't help but fall into a cycle of arguments which would often escalate into an emotional explosion on my part.  Due to this, I grew up feeling that I was a bad child.

After an attempt at moving away from home at 19 (to GET OUT OF THERE), I was in a bad car accident just two weeks after I left and moved a thousand miles away to Tacoma, Washington.  My dad came and got me a couple of months later and moved me home.

When I think back about my childhood, I have many happy memories (early life) and many very bad memories, which usually feel like a blur unless I focus on them.  In the 10 years since I have been an adult I believe I have come far to improve my emotional state and to move beyond my emotional baggage.  I am still a quite emotional person, but that only comes out excessively or negatively once in a great while.

I won't discuss my adult life in detail, but I thought I'd include my childhood info as insight into my personality beyond my type, especially why I'm so emotional.